# Community Participation > Mapping Challenge Suggestions >  Sword of truth

## ennob

Map an area (or the entire known world) from the epic fantasy series "The Sword of Truth" by Terry Goodkind.

There's already a rough map on the inside of the cover of all 11 books, so that would make a good starting point. There are a lot more details described in the books though so there should be plenty of possibilities for all.

I'm thinking about doing the sorceress' swamp from book 7 "The Pillars of Creation".

/ennob

P.S.: If you like books and didn't yet get around to reading The Sword of Truth, put it on your list. It's easily as good as The Wheel of Time.

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## Rythal

heh yeah I like the series, and the TV show Legend of the seeker was also half decent (in a cheesy sort of way).  (the quote at the bottom of my sig is from LotS.)

As to being as good as the wheel of time, I'd have to say it was better. Wheel of time really got boring after the 5th or 6th book for me, and I never could force myself past path of daggers.

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## Hai-Etlik

Considering how polarized opinion is about those books, perhaps something less controversial would be a better choice.  Or allow for any published fantasy world.

Either way, there is the problem that it could potential step on toes regarding copyright though (IANAL so I don't know how much of a problem this would be for sure.)

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## Jaxilon

Distinct disadvantage for those who haven't read it as far as options go.

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## verdilak

I love the SoT series (not the tv show very much though). I would be very keen to do a map for such a challenge.

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## ennob

> Considering how polarized opinion is about those books, perhaps something less controversial would be a better choice.  Or allow for any published fantasy world.
> 
> Either way, there is the problem that it could potential step on toes regarding copyright though (IANAL so I don't know how much of a problem this would be for sure.)


As long as we don't directly copy anything I think we should be OK. The creation of a map that doesn't exist in the books (or anywhere else) could at most be considered fan art, and it certainly seems to be "fair use".

We could also go for any published fantasy world but IMO it's somehow nicer if the maps have a common theme. Of course, as Jaxilon points out, people who didn't read any of the books will not find the challenge that easy. They will either have a bit of reading to do or they can just submit their latest village. The world is big enough that almost anything goes.

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## ennob

> I love the SoT series (not the tv show very much though). I would be very keen to do a map for such a challenge.


I completely agree. The TV show doesn't capture the characters at all and it deviates wildly from the story in the books.

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## Sapiento

> Distinct disadvantage for those who haven't read it as far as options go.


...Exactly

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## Quabbe

That could be an interesting challenge. I love the saga. Except maybe the last 15 books - the first two one were definitely the best in my opinion. Nevertheless, I had much fun reading them and the complete saga is simply epic.


Q

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## Avengeil

I don"t think that this is a good idea for a challenge because it would exclude many people because they don't know nothing about the saga (like me) and I don't think that there are many people around here who would read the books just to enter the challenge.

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## ennob

> That could be an interesting challenge. I love the saga. Except maybe the last 15 books - the first two one were definitely the best in my opinion. Nevertheless, I had much fun reading them and the complete saga is simply epic.


There are only 11 books. Maybe you're thinking of another series?

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## Quabbe

I'm pretty sure that I've read 17 books. Maybe they've split them in a few more parts in the german version?


Q

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## Midgardsormr

> As long as we don't directly copy anything I think we should be OK. The creation of a map that doesn't exist in the books (or anywhere else) could at most be considered fan art, and it certainly seems to be "fair use".


For what it's worth, Goodkind has expressly disallowed fan fiction. Any fan art that uses the names of characters and/or locations within his world are covered (probably) by copyright law. The law in most jurisdictions is rather hazy on that point, since copyright really isn't designed to cover the use of singular words like names. In any case, Goodkind disapproves of fan fiction set within his world, so I should think that artists should also tread lightly, and the Guild should not sponsor a challenge that contradicts an author's wishes (even indirectly).

http://www.fanhistory.com/wiki/Terry_Goodkind
Unfortunately, The Taint, which is the original source of this information, is now offline, and the Wayback Machine does not store forum databases. So there is no way at present to truly verify Goodkind's policy short of contacting him and asking.

edit:



> I'm pretty sure that I've read 17 books. Maybe they've split them in a few more parts in the german version?


Goodkind's books tend to be rather long. Robert Jordan's novels were split into multiple volumes when released in Germany for that reason (and the German versions had _much_ better cover art, by the way), so it would not be at all surprising if Goodkind's were treated the same way.

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## rdanhenry

It isn't just the need to read the books in order to enter the competition: I wouldn't really feel I could make an informed vote on the maps, since I wouldn't know a brilliantly researched one from a wildly inaccurate one, so I wouldn't vote.

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## mearrin69

I would certainly be interested in a "pick your literary inspiration" sort of mapping challenge. Open it up to the map-maker's favorite author/work and I think you'd get a lot of participation. I'd probably go sci-fi.
M

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## verdilak

> It isn't just the need to read the books in order to enter the competition: I wouldn't really feel I could make an informed vote on the maps, since I wouldn't know a brilliantly researched one from a wildly inaccurate one, so I wouldn't vote.


Heh, I kinda felt this way with the New York challenge maps, since all I know about New York is what i see on tv and the news, which isn't all that much.

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## ennob

> For what it's worth, Goodkind has expressly disallowed fan fiction. Any fan art that uses the names of characters and/or locations within his world are covered (probably) by copyright law. The law in most jurisdictions is rather hazy on that point, since copyright really isn't designed to cover the use of singular words like names. In any case, Goodkind disapproves of fan fiction set within his world, so I should think that artists should also tread lightly, and the Guild should not sponsor a challenge that contradicts an author's wishes (even indirectly).


Ah OK. I guess that settles it. What a shame, it's such a cool world. 

In light of that, I think mearrin69's suggestion about a "pick your literary inspiration" mapping challenge is a good substitute. Although it suffers from the same problem as this challenge in that it's hard to judge the contributions for outsiders. At least how well they adhere to the original source material.

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## jtougas

Hmm..Thomas Covenant anyone?......

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## verdilak

What about The Hobbit series? Or Elric Moorcock series? Or even the Wit'ch series?

Thomas Covenant, from what i remember, wasn't very descriptive of cities/lands, but then again, its been a long time since I read them.

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## jtougas

> What about The Hobbit series? Or Elric Moorcock series? Or even the Wit'ch series?
> 
> Thomas Covenant, from what i remember, wasn't very descriptive of cities/lands, but then again, its been a long time since I read them.


I don't know the descriptions of the Stonedown always makes me want to draw them..  :Smile:

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## mearrin69

Barring letting the cartographer choose his/her own inspiration you could pick a more widely read work such as _The Hobbit_, mentioned above, or _The Lord of the Rings_. I'm pretty sure most folks on here will have read those. I've read a lot of sci-fi but very little fantasy myself...Hobbit, LotR, Elric, and that's about it (yeah, I'm missing out but I haven't been all that impressed with most fantasy authors I've read).
M

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## Aval Penworth

> Hmm..Thomas Covenant anyone?......


I'd rather drown in a puddle...

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## jtougas

> I'd rather drown in a puddle...


Now I wonder if you just said that to get me to say something clever..?  :Smile:  Are you one of the "misinformed" horde that thinks the Unbeliever series is plodding and wordy?..  :Wink:

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## Aval Penworth

> Now I wonder if you just said that to get me to say something clever..?  Are you one of the "misinformed" horde that thinks the Unbeliever series is plodding and wordy?..


That was hours mind numbing boredom, punctuated with annoyance.

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## jtougas

I have a confession I actually read those books before I read the Lotr It was in fact one of the first fantasy series I had ever read. So I think that makes me partial to it.

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## NeonKnight

> Distinct disadvantage for those who haven't read it as far as options go.


It's why I voted NO  :Frown:

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## NeonKnight

> What about The Hobbit series? Or Elric Moorcock series? Or even the Wit'ch series?
> 
> Thomas Covenant, from what i remember, wasn't very descriptive of cities/lands, but then again, its been a long time since I read them.


I was thinking Just That! ELRIC of MELNIBONE and the Young King Kingdoms!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wasn't Thomas Covenant from the Deryni Series? Those read at times like History Texts.

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## Jaxilon

It looks like this one isn't going so well but while it's a good background for making some maps it would probably work best as fanart. 

Also,  remember while many of the people here are avid readers of fantasy there are a good number who are just into maps. Now if this was "Make a map based on a book", I think it would go quite differently. It may just be a bit too specific.

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## Gamerprinter

I voted NO, because I prefer to make completely original maps of original places (of my own creation) - not making maps of other people's places, unless I'm getting a paid commission to do so. In other words if the publishers of the LotR wanted me to make a map of Middle Earth and paid me to do so - I'm willing to do it. But for a challenge map? No, not interested. If you look through all the challenges over the past three years, all but one maybe is about are all original map subjects.

For example while I do plan to create at least one map for the New York (September-October) challenge - its not really what I prefer to do. I don't really want to make a map of a real city, ever. I prefer maps of my own creation from scratch, based on an idea perhaps, but not on an existing map. That's no fun for me. However, for the sake of the Soho Gallery, is the only reason to do otherwise.

GP

PS: I don't mind reading trilogies, but even the Song of Ice and Fire, which is currently at book five, has me bored to tears - I don't want to read a series that's more than 3 books if I can help it. So I'd never read the Sword of Truth, or Wheel of Time or any other series of too damn many books...  :Razz:

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## RecklessEnthusiasm

Is Song of Ice and Fire at book five now? I am just finishing book four now--I normally wait to read series books until the last one is out. I hate waiting and now I'm going to be waiting five years to hear the conclusion! I didn't pick up The Dark Tower until the last one was out for this reason. <grumble grumble>

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## Gamerprinter

It was supposed to be released for September, but I haven't checked if that's true or not.

GP

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## geamon

A Dance With Dragons still hasn't been released yet unfortunately. I think Raymond E Feist takes the cake with number of books published. Don't know if the page count is greater then Goodkind. Took me two tries from start to finish to actually get through Goodkind's novels, always lost interest 75% of the way through. I voted no just for the sake of challenges need to be open in their subject to prevent alienating people from it. It's supposed to invite people to participate not push them away.

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## Ramah

Isn't Terry Goodkind soundly kicked by most people in the blogosphere? I seem to recall reading a very long thread on the Westeros forums that made daily fun of his characters and made me cringe.

I've never read any of the books though and I understand they are very popular but I fear they're not for me. So I'd say no to this.

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## geamon

No his characters and story are fine and interesting. But revisiting the same themes each novel and having this ascension of power that get larger with each novel and the main character unable to use them is kinda ehhh.

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## Djekspek

read them, liked them, but didn't love them. But thanks for posting as it pointed me to the TV-series they made of it, and maybe I'm gonne love watching them... Making a better map then the standard boring map of that world he put in the novels... Hey, why not? cheers!

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## jtougas

> I was thinking Just That! ELRIC of MELNIBONE and the Young King Kingdoms!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Wasn't Thomas Covenant from the Deryni Series? Those read at times like History Texts.


The chronicles of the unbeliever.. Classic epic fantasy very Lotr but with a "hero" that just wants to be left alone with his leprosy and self hate...

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## Jaxilon

> read them, liked them, but didn't love them. But thanks for posting as it pointed me to the TV-series they made of it, and maybe I'm gonne love watching them... Making a better map then the standard boring map of that world he put in the novels... Hey, why not? cheers!


I liked the costumes, especially the chick's. She always had cool stuff on  :Smile:   The TV show was alright to watch but bugged me because it was just so weak compared to the novels. Still, fun to look at. I actually really enjoyed the first few books but burned out waiting. I'm with RecklessE on that because I almost always wait for the last book to be published. When I read I read like a starved animal and burn through the books until I'm done. Then I may not read for 4 or 5 months. The last thing I need is to get rolling and have to futz around waiting for another book to come out.

Boy has this thread wavered off course or what?

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## Diamond

I wouldn't mind doing a map based on a book; though we've had contests like that before, I'm always up for another one...  But I can't see doing one based on Goodkind's 'novels'.




> I'd rather drown in a puddle...


 That's pretty much the way I feel about Goodkind.  The guy is a misogynistic hack.




> I didn't pick up The Dark Tower until the last one was out for this reason. <grumble grumble>


Are you sorry you read past 'Wizard and Glass'?  I know I am...

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## Ramah

> That's pretty much the way I feel about Goodkind.  The guy is a misogynistic hack.


That's pretty much what I had heard, and what 99% of online reviewers thinks about him. I was beginning to doubt my own memory though due to the disproportionate amount of fans in this thread.

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## RecklessEnthusiasm

> Are you sorry you read past 'Wizard and Glass'?  I know I am...


Hah, I know what you mean, but I am glad I finished it. I thought the 'ending' was more appropriate and satisfying than most people seem to, but you're right that the last three books dropped remarkably in quality and became _painfully_ self-indulgent. I won't mention any details for fear of spoilers but for goodness sakes, get _over_ yourself, King.

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## RecklessEnthusiasm

I too voted no as I've not read any of his work, and agree that it is probably best to have a more open/flexible challenge to draw more people in. Heck, even this month's lite challenge, which is pretty open, has turned me off, simply because I've never done a city-scale map before.

Sorry, this IS getting off topic, but... 

Jaxilon - I ended up trying the first of the Wind On Fire series. I read a few chapters and just couldn't get into it. I know you recommended them really highly, so I ask your advice: do I just need to push through for another chapter or two, or what?

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## rtdownward

I have seen the map from the book, but would like to see other maps of specific areas such as the Old Worls, The Deep Nothing, etc.

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