# Mapmaking Discussion & Philosophy (WIP/Critique) > Dungeon/Subterranean Mapping >  [WIP] Castle Ravenloft 2D Battle Maps REDUX!

## wthrasherb

Hey folks! I just got my hands on the new Curse of Strahd D&D adventure and, like so many others, I purchased the digital maps to use online in a virtual tabletop environment and there are no maps of CASTLE RAVENLOFT!??? Sure, I got the awesome poster map with the adventure, but I'm playing online. So what's one to do? Well, thank goodness for this guild and it's awesome members! I found some maps of castle ravenloft on here (found here: http://www.cartographersguild.com/sh...ad.php?t=13943). 

Unfortunately, Shindig did THOSE maps for the 3rd edition Expedition to Castle Ravenloft adventure and some visual elements are included in his (her?) maps that don't match with the latest incarnation of the D&D classic. So I have take on a labor of love and I am redrawing the maps that Shindig made previously. Shindig's maps are also labeled differently than the Curse of Strahd has them labeled so I will be drawing/labeling them according to the Curse of Strahd adventure.

@Shindig, I hope you are cool with this. I don't take any credit for the efforts you made in converting the isometric maps to 2D or ANY of the layout. I am essentially just "reskinning" the visual elements to fit the newest adventure. Thanks for all your hard work!

Any feedback or comments are welcome as usual. I haven't made it very far yet. I JUST started today, but here is what I have so far...

This is the start of the left edge of "map 2" in the adventure, "Walls of Ravenloft". Due to the large size of the map, just like Shindig, I have broken this entire map into 3 pieces. This is the first piece... This is also a lower resolution version due to the upload limitations of the site.

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## wthrasherb

Here's as far as I made it for today. This piece is ALMOST finished I think. I might add a portcullis and some gargoyles, but I'm not sure on those yet. They are in the descriptive text but I'm not sure how practical they are on a map of this scale for battle map purposes. There are no main encounters on this map either, so I don't want to spend TOO much time on it. Hopefully I can finish the other 2 parts tomorrow.



EDIT: I just noticed that I have the rocky base that the castle is sitting on as fairly dark, so I thought the castle should be darker stone. It IS Castle Ravenloft afterall. 

So I need some feedback on these two choices: A) Light Colored Castle (above), or B) Dark Colored Castle (below)??? Thanks in advance!



EDIT #2: Moderators, now that I think about it, this post MIGHT need to be in the VTT/Battle Map Forum... dunno what ya'll prefer. I was just thinking 'dungeon' so I put it in the dungeon forum. Doesn't matter to me, but these maps are set to scale for mini use. And for those interested, the grid that is on there right now is a 70 px per square grid (standard for Roll20), each square being 5 feet.

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## wthrasherb

Before I got too far redrawing this beast of a dungeon I wanted to make sure my scale was still correct after compression for the virtual tabletop site (they have a 10 MB limit on individual file size). I just did a quick upload of the piece I have previously posted here and added some minis for size and turned on the VTT grid to a obvious red so everyone here can see that my grid and the VTT grid match up perfectly. Again, the grid is standard D&D, 5 ft. per square. Here's a quick screen shot:

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## designbot

Looking good. Personally, I prefer the lighter castle. I'll probably be printing or projecting maps for use at the table, so it would be helpful for me if you could maintain a copy with as high a resolution as possible, even if it can't be uploaded to Roll20 or this site at that resolution.

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## wthrasherb

@designbot, I JUST sent you an email right before I saw your post on here... full res versions will be available at the end. I will upload to my google drive. Be advised, I am making these PRIMARILY for digital use, but I will do my best to size some versions for print. I just tested a resize up to a 1 inch grid and this first piece of map that I have done so far is 66.35 in x 100.1 in. @ 100 ppi. I sized that based off of Jon Roberts suggestions on his site here. I saved this test run as a tif, but most printers should be able to handle that.

As for lighter or darker... I personally LIKE the dark stone, BUT it may be TOO dark once I get to the interior and start adding details and such... either way, it's a simple color overlay that I can remove for those that might prefer one over the other. Once this project is done I will put together all the maps in some nice orderly fashion with variations and such available. 

Thanks for the feedback! Stay tuned, more to come!!!

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! I had a busy day yesterday, so I didn't get much map work done. I'm trying to make up for it today though! 

The piece I've been working on is "finished". There are a few nit-picky details I might "clean up", but the map is finished for the most part.



I've started on the next section. Shindig had his maps broken up kinda weird for file size purposes I think, so I'm ATTEMPTING to merge the last two slices of his map (parts b and c) into one. Also, this map will include what is "MAP 3, MAIN FLOOR" in the Curse of Strahd Adventure. Map 2, Walls of Ravenloft, just doesn't really have any "encounter" material written in the adventure, and both the main castle gate AND the front doors to the Keep are WIDE OPEN when the characters arrive at those locations initially, so I figure they won't dally too much.

Here's all I have so far for the other 2/3rds of this current map:



And here is a quick "attachment" test to see how these two parts match up since I did them individually. I have turned off the grid/gloom/mists overlays on the first map portion since I haven't added those elements to what I've done today...



You can clearly see there are some matching issues and an obvious seam. 

*Lesson: do maps like this all as one piece THEN cut it apart.* 

I'm not working with the beefiest of computers, so I'm always hesitant to work on super huge files.

Ok, so Yesterday I did an upload test to Roll20 of that first map piece to see how it looked after compressing. It looked fine and the grids/dimensions are perfect. If I try to create ONE HUGE MAP for this part not only will I have to possibly compress it too much to make it uploadable to Roll20, but there is no "functional" need to have this large of a map ALL on one "page". Depending on how the DM runs the game, there's not REALLY any encounter material setup for the outer courtyards and gates and such. So for now I'm not going to correct the "joining" issue. *The pieces are intended to be used separately in my game*. If for some reason I get a ton of requests to make it all one map, I MIGHT take the time and go back and correct stuff. But for now I'm trying to work as fast as I can in my free time to get some decent usable maps for my game and get the adventure up and running.

Also, FOR NOW, I'm trying the castle walls as the dark color they are here, but the INTERIOR keep walls/color scheme may be slightly lighter. I'm not sure yet, but I'm pretty sure I don't want it as dark as the outside walls.

Please feel free to leave feedback and/or comments. 

I know there's not much "map" to comment on yet... be patient! More coming soon...  :Smile:

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## wthrasherb

Hey guild and Ravenloft fans! More progress to share! Coming along slowly but surely!

I don't really have much to say here, just posting the latest progress image.



More to come!

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## Gold

Following your progress on these Ravenloft inspired old-school adventuring, virtual-tabletop-oriented digital maps. Looks nice so far. I saw your post on Roll20 and as you can see I'm a Cartographer's Guild member too. Best wishes on your mapping and thanks for sharing the results and tips/findings along the journey to create your version of this.

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## Falconius

Personally I'm a fan of those very fine grid lines you've got there, and I don't know if this is an issue or not, but they get very difficult to discern when they go over the flagstones.  Perhaps if they were a contrasting colour like white it would be clearer?

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## Jacktannery

wthrasherb, nice maps. I find them quite dark overall. I think this is caused by the white cloudy/snowy parts at the edges. I would recommend changing these white parts to pure black, in order to make them fade completely into the background and emphasise the playable parts of your map. I would also brighten up the map a wee bit. Regarding your floor texture, I agree with Falconius, maybe change to a simpler style? I attach quick examples of what I mean.

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! Thanks for the feedback!

@Jacktannery, the white cloudy stuff is "The Mist" of Ravenloft. It doesn't have to stay and the background under that layer in Photoshop IS black, so that could be an easy fix. Right now I'm going to focus on getting the map done and then I will go back and adjust the overall aesthetic details. Unlike most maps on this forums this one isn't going to be as much of an "art project" as much as just trying to put together a visually appealing FUNCTIONAL map. I have already found things I would like to go back and do over, do a different way, or edit otherwise, but I'm just leaving it alone for now and trying to get usable maps up for my game and anyone else who needs them. What I plan on doing at the end of the project is to have some variations put together in a zip file or on my Google Drive and then people would have some choices on their preference. I agree the coloring is just a tiny bit dark on the walls, but I'm not sure the rest of the map needs to be brightened up. MAYBE a touch... but that comes at the end either in my workflow. Thanks for the feedback. Keep it coming!

@Falconius, the Grid is hard to see on the floor pattern. I made some adjustments last night that make it look better, but I'm not sure you can really see the grid lines still. I will work on it. I personally turn on the grid in Roll20 and usually set it to some bright color that  stands out. That way I don't have to deal with the grid issue when i'm making my maps. I have included the grid here MAINLY just to keep an eye on scale and such while I'm laying the dungeon out and for when I reference the adventure maps. I will work on it and try to make it better for those who want the grid on the map. There will be versions that offer with and without a grid in the end. Thanks for the feedback!

Great stuff folks! Keep it coming! 

I've been out of town ALL DAY and JUST got home, so I haven't made much progress since the last post. I'm pooped, so I'm not sure how much work I will get finished today. Be patient... it's coming  :Wink:

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## wthrasherb

I have been saying (thinking?) the word stairs so much since yesterday that the word itself has started to sound weird. ANYWAY, I have rested from my all day outing yesterday and I'm nice and refreshed and ready to get grinding on this map today!

Today's goal is, as the post Title says: S T A I R S. 

This dungeon has all kinds of stairwells, some spiral and some straight. I've always used pre-drawn map symbols for these VTT maps, but today I'm learning how to make my own damn stairs.  :Smile:  After going through my map symbol collections and a few failed experiments on the best way to do these stairs I have decided that map symbols aren't going to work AND look good. I found a short tutorial on the guild here about shading stairs, but anomiecoalition starts with some sort of pre-generated graphic from Campaign Cartographer and I need to be a little more flexible than that. I'm going to use anomiecoalition's shading method for the stairs, but I'm going to draw my own in Adobe Illustrator and then import them into Photoshop. I'm not nearly as experienced with Illustrator as I am Photoshop, so there might be a little trial and error in the beginning. 

If ANYONE has more tips for doing STAIRS, PLEASE send them my way! Thanks in advance!

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## Hervis

Here are a couple that I used when making my version of these maps (Keith on Roll20).  Your maps look great BTW.

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## Hervis

Be aware that two of the spiral stairs between Larders of Ill Omen and the Dungeons and Catacombs do not line up.  There is another one from their is a straight stair from the Court of the Count up to the Rooms of Weeping that is also too short.

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## wthrasherb

@Hervis, Thanks dude! I started to ask you on Roll20, but decided I should teach myself. I'm going to try yours for now and see how I like it and THEN might take the time to do my own. Good looking out man!

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## wthrasherb

Do you mean they don't "line up" from level to level or what? And what are you talking about the "too short" part? Thanks for the help!

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## Hervis

Let me see if I can explain.

If you look at the position of the large staircase that goes all the way from the crypt to the top of the tower (K18 in the original module) as compared to the nearby one that goes from the dungeon upward (K21 in the original), you will notice that on the Larders of Ill Omen (and above) that the smaller staircase's center is in a different relative location to the large one.  On the bottom level it is 10' west and 40' south of the larger staircase.  On all of the other levels it is 30' west and 10' south.

The long hallway that leads from the brazier room doesn't also line up with the crypt that it comes up to.  Here is an image that I hope helps explain it.



The 'too short' one is on the Court of the count, there is a long staircase near the north west corner that takes a turn up into the room with the 10 statues on the Rooms of weeping.  This staircase shows that is goes 40' west, turns left, the becomes a half spiral at the end.  In order for it to reach the destination shown on Rooms of Weeping it would have to go 50' West before turning to the left.

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! This is just a quick image post of how I've adjusted the floor pattern inside the keep and adjusted the grid to be plainly visible. I've also been working on figuring out how to do stairs all day. Some of you may laugh, but every version I tried today looked like crap and I had to try try again  :Wink:  I also wasted A LOT of time in Illustrator. I finally figured out how to create a satisfying "stairs effect" that I SHOULD just be able to use as a sort of template from here forward, but it's not quite finished... I need YOUR help! 



How do the stairs look? Do they look like they are going UP or DOWN? 

What about the grid? How does it look now? Does it stand out enough now with the floor pattern?

Any other comments or thoughts on the stairs or grid?

Thanks!

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## wthrasherb

Ok, still no feedback from the community, but I'm still diligently working to make this map look better!  :Smile:  I'm still focusing on the stairs until I get them right... that time may have come, at least for spiral stairs (strait stairs should be easy after this). I personally think this version looks great (just looking at the stairs here), but I'm still not sure I have the "UP and DOWN" effect correct yet.\

In this image  the stairs at the top should look like they are going "UP" and the stairs on the bottom should look like they are going "DOWN". 

Please let me know what you think. Thanks!

Oh, and for those of you following my progress, I may slow down some due to starting a new job tomorrow... don't know exactly what kind of schedule/hours I'm working yet...

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## Bogie

Nice work.  The grid looks ok on the lighter floor, but the glowing grid lines are distracting where it is above the darker stairwell.  The stairs are clearly going down.  I would consider putting a wall or a railing dividing the break between the lighter floor and the drop to the darker lower stairwell.  The code enforcement officer will write you up for having an open unprotected drop, very hazardous.   :Wink: 

EDIT, You posted before I could.
Oops,  Nevermind, now I see you were going to go with stairs on both sides.

The stairs have a nice look to them and work the way they are intended.

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## wthrasherb

@Bogie, I agree the grid is a little distracting on the stairs. That can be masked out later prob. As for the direction of travel, do BOTH sets look like they are going down?  :Frown: 

How can I make the top set look like they are going UP and the bottom set look like they are going down?

Thanks in advance for any input! I may be getting to bed soon, but I'll be back at it, bright and early in the morning.

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## wthrasherb

Ok, last thing and I'm off to bed for the night...

I just did a quick clean up of the grid lines over the stairs and I added some temporary notes to point out the directions I am intending for the stairs to be travelling. 

Any feedback would be great!  Thanks!

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## Falconius

It is because the "up" stairs also fade to black that makes it look like its receding.  It would seem to me they need to get lighter as they ascend.  I'd say get rid of that fade altogether there and just choose a stair to end on and have the black fill after that.

Other than that issue I think they look pretty fantastic, as do the other changes.

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## Jacktannery

Your stairs work really well - well done. I would be happy with them if I was you, I don't think you need to change them. It's obvious to me which part is going up and down. Good job.

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## Hervis

Both of the stairs in that stairwell look like they are going down.  You should horizontally flip the stair overlay on the Top half (but keep the gradient as it is) so that they look like they are going different directions.  That stairway spirals up counter clockwise.  The shaded part of the tread should always be downward of the highlighted edge.

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## Hervis

> Both of the stairs in that stairwell look like they are going down.  You should horizontally flip the stair overlay on the Top half (but keep the gradient as it is) so that they look like they are going different directions.  That stairway spirals up counter clockwise.  The shaded part of the tread should always be downward of the highlighted edge.


I see it now.  They look good.

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! Thanks for taking the time to provide some feedback. I cranked up Photoshop and started trying some things... tell me what you think of this:



On the stairs going up (the top set of stairs) I removed the gradient and eased off the fade to black some. Does this look better? Is it easier to tell which ones are going "UP" and which ones are going "DOWN" now?

Thanks!

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## Hervis

I think that those look the best so far.  Keep up the good work.

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## wthrasherb

Thanks Hervis! That's what I needed to hear!

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## WolfgangSho

Hey wthrasherb,

I made an account on this forum just because of this project, your work is looking great so far, please keep going! If there is anything people can do to help, just ask. There are a LOT of people looking for a nice workable map of Castle Ravenloft.

Just a heads up, someone posted this thread to reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/dndnext/com...ild_is_making/

Which is how I know about this. Thought I'd make an account here and say how awesome your progress is!

Thanks!

WolfgangSho

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## wthrasherb

> Hey wthrasherb,
> 
> I made an account on this forum just because of this project, your work is looking great so far, please keep going! If there is anything people can do to help, just ask. There are a LOT of people looking for a nice workable map of Castle Ravenloft.
> 
> Just a heads up, someone posted this thread to reddit:
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/r/dndnext/com...ild_is_making/
> 
> Which is how I know about this. Thought I'd make an account here and say how awesome your progress is!
> ...


Neat!  :Smile:  Thanks for the kinds words and the encouragement! It really helps. I will DEFINITELY keep working, but my progress has been slowed a little due to starting a new job. Gotta love unemployment for the time it gives ya to do art, but art doesn't pay the bills....... yet  :Wink:  So everyone reading this, please be patient. I will work as fast as I am able.

I've made it a little further than my last post, but I'm still just working on stairs. I'm taking extra care with them, because I've tried a few variations on how to do the stairs and MOST of them looked horrible. I figure I wouldn't post every time I draw a new set of stairs  :Wink:  Fear not, I'm still working, slowly, but surely.

I should be able to get some good work done tomorrow. Stay tuned!

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## wthrasherb

Just a quick post so people know I'm still working  :Wink: 

These stairs are kicking my ass... but I think I'm figuring it out now.

These are the smaller stairwells K64 and K21.



I know there's not much to comment on, but any feedback is always welcome!

Thanks!

More to come!

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## Jacktannery

Hmm. I'm not sure its much of an improvement to be honest. At the end of the day, it's something that's virtually impossible to protray realistically. I remember trying on my watchtower map, which was unsatisfying if I recall. I recommend you just keep it simple, it probably doesn't really matter which way is up or down, people will be able to work it out, and don't worry about it too much. Perfect something that's actually perfectable.

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## Savage Orc

I think your stairs, and your maps overall, look very good. Even earlier versions I could tell what was going up or down.

If I was going to nitpick the only thing I would say is maybe the stair shadows could be slightly transparent (not solid black) and the edge of the shadow on the stairs going down (like the part just to the right of the horizontal red arrow tip on the last update of the two stairwells) could be less hard, more feathered.

But that is very minor and I'm not familiar with VTT so my comments may be moot.

Great job so far on these maps.

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## Falconius

The down stairs are very clearly going down, as they always have been and the up stairs are distinct enough from them to look like they could be going up.  I would still suggest shading the down stairs to give them depth going down to the shown level.

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## wthrasherb

Thanks for the feedback folks! I appreciate you taking the time to stop by and comment.  :Smile: 

@Jacktannery, it is visually "impossible", but I'm close enough for my tastes. Nothing about this map is perfect though, nor am I going to try to make it "perfect".

@Savage Orc, the hard line at the very top step going down will be masked out in one of my "clean ups". When I make maps like this piece by piece, I usually wait until I have a few new things done and then go back and "polish up" the details. There are a few touch ups I need to make overall. As for the stair shadow, I'm not sure if you are talking about the shadow "Fade" at the "end" of the stairs or the individual step shadows between each step... either way, I'm not going to change much about them now. I'm satisfied with them for the most part and I've spent too much time on stairs already, so I need to move on. I still really appreciate the feedback.

@Falconius, thanks for the kind words. The down stairs ARE shaded and I'm not going to shade any further. I had them shaded more in the beginning and they were too dark. What I've got will have to do  :Wink: 

Again, thank you all for taking the time to comment. Keep them coming!

I'm trying to crank out some good work over the rest of this weekend. I'd like to finish this main floor map completely, but at my current rate of work that doesn't seem like a realistic goal by bed time Sunday... we'll see...

Stay tuned!

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## Falconius

Yes my apologies, I meant the "up" stairs, the "down" stairs are great.  In other words the "Up" stairs should be shaded deeper as they descend to the main level otherwise they may all look like they are on the same plane but tilted like a turbine.

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## wthrasherb

> Yes my apologies, I meant the "up" stairs, the "down" stairs are great.  In other words the "Up" stairs should be shaded deeper as they descend to the main level otherwise they may all look like they are on the same plane but tilted like a turbine.


ah.... I will look into this... thanks!  :Smile:

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## wthrasherb

Ok folks, still slowly plugging along on the stairs of Map 3. Now that I have a method down it is going A LITTLE faster, but not much. 

This is just a quick progress post. I've cleaned up all the stairs and adjusted some shadows and such. I've been TRYING to come up with a "mosaic" pattern for the floor in room K20 (with the curved stairs and square stairs going down), but so far nothing looks right. The adventure text just states "a mosaic floor adds a touch of color...". It doesn't specify what KIND of mosaic or what colors or anything, so I'm open to suggestions if anyone has any good ideas. For now I'm going to leave that detail to the descriptive text.

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## Falconius

Wow looks great all together.  Also looks like a very dangerous place to get lost in.

For the mosaic something Gothically nostalgic?  Or it could just be a pattern too...

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## Hervis

Since that is the room that leads up to the 'Throne' room on level 2 I would recommend some kind of heraldic raven.

Something like this...

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...38cde4bcc8.jpg

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## wthrasherb

@ Falconius, Thanks for the kind words.

@Hervis, I'm not talking about THAT room with the 2 statues and two straight stair cases, but I have been trying to find a good raven image to use in a similar fashion to what you are talking about... Here's the room I'm talking about**:



The mosaic I have added here is not necessarily what I'm going with. I needed to post an example of what I'm dealing with in hopes of getting some feedback. As you can see the shape of the room is weird to begin with. Then you have those two sets of stairs mucking up anything that might make a decent mosaic picture/pattern on the floor. That being said, I want to go with some kind of generic pattern. Again, the descriptive text is vague and only indicates that there is a colorful mosaic pattern on the floor here.

The other issue I'm having is the shape of the room and where the mosaic floor starts. I originally did not have it extend into the hallway, but it looked strange. I'm still not sure it looks right. And those stairs right in the middle of the floor... I mean, there's just no way to make them not look weird sitting in the middle of anything I've tried so far, so I'm all ears on this one...

I'm not going to spend TOO much time on this one. It is a detail that can be left to the descriptive text if need be. I don't want to ruin the look of the entire map just to try to poorly represent something visually when the players' imaginations should do the trick  :Wink: 

I'm looking for thoughts on how to do a good mosaic pattern in this room (pictured above). I'm not looking for a critique of the pattern I have displayed right now. It is just for representation purposes for now. Thanks in advance!

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## Hervis

I should have remembered that.  I tried about 5 different things before I just left the floor like the rest of the castle.  If you did want to do something you should try this (I use GIMP not PS so you may need to convert)

Make a threshold (wide line of some sort) between the hallway and the room.  This will make the transition less weird.

Fill the area with plasm (Filter -> render -> clouds -> plasma)
Desatuate.
Colorize to whatever hue you like
Filter -> Distort -> Mosaic.  Set the tile shape and size that you like.

This will generate a random mosaic pattern instead of a pattern that will be distracting.

Here is a sample of one that I tried for my version.  I shrank my room a little bit so it looks a little different, but you will get the idea

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## wthrasherb

@Hervis, I tried something like that previously. I still don't like it... I think I'm just going to leave it alone and people will just have to use their imagination  :Wink:  Thanks for the input!

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## Falconius

I like that example you posted actually, except that the tiles are too large.  Most historical mosaics were busy with all sorts of stuff and I think that fits imo.

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## madcowchef

I think you've got a good start really.  I'd be inclined to do a mosaic that was broken into three spheres, a large one in front of the square stairs and two smaller ones on either side.  The mosaic doesn't have to cover the whole floor.  It doesn't make sense to have a pattern visible only from a cut away view of a building when the intended viewer would be some actually moving through the building.

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## wthrasherb

Finially I'm finished with these friggin stairs! I'm tired of staring at stairs. ;p

Anyway, here's my progress so far. I'm still not sure about keeping the "mosaic" on the map, but I've left it on this post just to see if more people give me feedback. I'm not going to do MORE work on it at this point. It is only a matter of keeping it or dropping it. The stairs aren't perfect, but they will have to do. Hopefully I can reuse some graphic elements on other levels of the castle and make the process go a little quicker than this level has gone.

Now it is time to start adding a little detail. I'll probably continue with the main stuff like doors and windows next, then columns and statues, and furniture and what not. I'm not going to over do it and junk up the map. I want it to look as close to the text as I can make a 2D battle map look, but I'm not going to force it. I'm starting to ramble... it's time for bed. 

Comments and Feedback welcome!

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## Bogie

Great job, that has come out very nice.

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## Jacktannery

I LOVE that mosaic you posted above (Post 42). Really lovely. As for a heraldic raven design, I made a floor with large heraldic raven designs in a map I attach below, see top right round tower. I prefer your mosaic though - it's more fun! But if you want to reuse mine I could root out the original file and send it on.

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## wthrasherb

Thanks folks for the kind words and feeback! 

@Jacktannery, I'm glad you like the mosaic. I just redid one this weekend while I was doing a little touch up work on some of the pattern fills and such. I will post an update later today or tomorrow and see what people think of the 2 different mosaics. After that, I'm not fooling with it any more. As for the raven you offered up, thanks! I might want something like that somewhere in this project.

For anyone that may be waiting on these maps for their Curse of Strahd game, I'm sorry I'm so slow... Real Life Adult stuff and all getting in the way all the time  :Wink:  Patience  :Wink: 

Stay tuned! More coming soon!

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! Just a quick progress update. Here are the front doors (area K7). I'm not sure I'm going to keep the "torch glow" on the map since I will be using "dynamic lighting" in Roll20, but for now it is there just to see how it looks. How does the fire and such look? 



And here is an alternate mosaic for room K20. My Real Life friends were split... some liked one, some like the other. I personally like the map better without the mosaic on there... but maybe once I get some more decor added it won't look so out of place.



Sorry, I know this isn't much progress, but slow and steady wins the race  :Wink:

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## evewillow

@wthrasherb You are doing the gods work, and I thank you. Take your time! Hopefully, it'll take awhile before my group wants to storm the castle.

Personally, I like the new mosaic. A bit of beauty in the dark castle.

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! Sorry I've been quiet for a while... Just a lot going on! Anyway, here is my progress so far. I've cleaned up a few elements like wall edges and the grid. I added a better texture to the rocky cliff edges and touched up the dirt a bit (although I know these aren't crucial elements, they were just bothering me). I've also added the doors for this level. 

I have a question for the community: Should I bother with windows/arrow slits? There are not a whole lot of windows, but there are a few "arrow slits" here and there. I can take the time to add them even though they are mentioned in the text, but do I really NEED to? Tell me what you think!

That's all I've got for now. I'm going to keep working and you'll see more when I have more! Stay tuned!  :Smile:

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## madcowchef

If your have players or enemies that can conceivably use them for entrances and exits (bat and human sized clouds of mist come to mind), spot events, or attack through them then that's information important to have on the map.  I'm really enjoying watching your progress.  Keep up the good work.

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## Hervis

I would put some kind of indicator of where the arrow slits are on the map, even if you don't break the wall like you might for a window.  A darker or lighter gray triangle would do nicely.

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## JTM_77583

the mosaic looks amazing.  Nicely done.

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## DownDeep

wthrasherb, I love what you and Shindig have done with the castle maps. I joined this forum mainly to let you know about the inconsistencies I've found in the maps. I'll reference 3 maps: the original (I6), the reproductions in Curse of Strahd (CoS), and Shindig's (SD). I may have misinterpreted some of these details, so if anyone disagrees about any of it, please let us all know.

-----
Main Floor (map 3), at ground level:
The stairs K29 show a landing halfway up. This makes the stairs ridiculously steep! The landing is shown to be 10' wide, so that means each leg of the stairs needs to rise 25' vertically in 10' of horizontal space. That means the stairs rise at an angle of 68 degrees, which is basically a ladder. There are two options: (1) keep the landing as is and make the stairs that steep; could be interesting for the players. (2) get rid of the landing and make the stairs conitue upward where tha landing would be; that gives 40' of horizontal room to ascend 50' vertically, which is a more managable angle of 51 degrees (although still steep).

The stairs K20a are likewise quite steep, although the maps seem to show a landing that is only 5' wide, so each leg of the stairs descends 20' vertically in 15' of horizontal space, for an angle of 53 degrees (pretty steep). If you look at the I6 map 11, though, it looks like these stairs curve up instead of having a landing. That would give us a total of 40' horizontal room for the 40' of vertical, which gives us our standard 45-degree staircase that we find throughout the castle. I'm in favor of having the stairs behave this way, with no landing.

SD map makes it look like a wall blocks the K64 stairs from descending; the wall should not be there.

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2nd Floor (map 4), 50' above ground level:
Again, SD map makes it look like a wall blocks the K64 stairs from descending; the wall should not be there.

SD map for K34 is missing the ladder. (Probably on purpose, since it's in a secret area.) Would be nice to have a PNG layover that shows the ladder.

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3rd Floor (map 5), 40' above 2nd floor, 90' above ground level:
SD map is missing the ladders to the rooptops of the 2 western towers of K46. Based upon the I6 map that shows the vertical heights, I believe the tower rooftops are 40' above the floor of K46, with the tower battlements rising to alternating heights of 4' and 7' above the rooftop floor.

Small obvious typo in CoS, where K21 goes up 40' to map 6 (not map 5).

There are 5 windows in the upper reaches (but below the rafters) of the belfry, K40. Map 6 of CoS and I6 clearly shows them (3 of them, with 2 more on the side of the belfry we can't see from the map). I think the best way to show these windows is to do so on the map for the 4th floor.

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4th Floor (map 6), 40' above 3rd floor, 130' above ground level:
Belfry windows: In the SD map, I think you could show an open space (with cobwebs) where the belfry is (rather than showing the belfry rooftoop). Then show the 5 windows here. Note that the belfry rafters and bell are above these windows. Also, the peak of the belfry rooftop looks to be at least even (if not higher) to the smokestack K52, which is listed as being 30' above the roof peak.

SD map for the smokestack: since it's top is 30' above this level, I think you should show just the smokestack space here (filled with smoke), but not show any smoke blowing out of the stack until the map for the next level higher.

K52 typo in I6 and CoS: if the smokestack is 30' above the peak of the roof, and the 4th floor is level with this peak (which it seems to be in map 6), then it's a 70' drop down the smokestack (not 60').

Shindig: brilliant work on showing the western tower rooftops at this level! I feel that map 6 of both I6 and CoS miss showing this detail.

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5th Floor (map 7), 40' above 4th floor, 170' above ground level:
Typo in I6 and CoS: at K48 the stairs go down 40' (not 20') to map 6.

I like what Shindig did with keeping all 3 towers in their correct positions, but instead of a black background all around I would prefer to see the rooftops below. This is where you would show the roof of the belfry and the smoke blowing out of the smokestack. I think that by showing the rooftops below, it helps people understand where these towers are in the castle at this height.

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6th Floor (map 8 ), 20' above 5th floor, 190' above ground level:

SD map: I love the floating gem in the center of K20--it matches the text and looks much better than the ridiculous heart shown in I6 and CoS.

To be clear, even though the central shaft of K20 drops 190' to map 3 (ground level), the stairs go down only 100' before the players can exit them, in K46 on map 5 (3rd floor).

Again, I would show the rooftops below, a bit more out of focus than what was shown on map 7.

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7th Floor (map 9), 50' above 6th floor, 240' above ground level:
SD map: very wrong (considering the attention to detail in his maps, I'm assuming the description in the 3.5 Expedition to Castle Ravenloft is different from the description in I6 and CoS). There are no coffins or separate room in the north tower peak at this level. There are manacles on the wall and a ladder that leads to the roof of the tower (10' above: 9' ceiling + 1' thick floor).

We're now 110' above the rooftops, which is probably too high to see them anymore. But some sort of foggy, blurry hint that they are below might be cool and keep the towers in context with the rest of the castle. Also, the roof of the fat tower (K57) is only 50' below and should be shown out of focus below.

How do you want to show the roof of the north tower (K60a)? You could show it as part of map 10, but it would be 50' below that level, so that's a bit misleading. Does it deserve its own level? (I think it does.)

----
7.5th floor, 10' above 7th floor, 250' above ground level:
K60a, the roof of the north tower, is at this level. Tops of the battlements are again about 4' and 7' above the floor (same as western towers).

The roof of the fat tower (K57) is now 60' below, so I think it should still be shown (out of focus), but I think at this point everyone understands that there are roofs below that we can no longer see.

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8th Floor (map 10), 60' above 7th floor, 50' above the 7.5th floor, 300' above ground level:
Typo in I6 and CoS: the shaft of K18a drops 390' (not 380') to map 12. Also the arrow in CoS should be pointing to the shaft, not the stairs. The stairs go down 300' before the players can exit at map 3 (ground level). Finally, the text in CoS for K59 should say that the shaft descends 390' (not 450').

The roof of the north tower is 50' below, so we should see it (out of focus). The roof of the fat tower (K57) is now 110' below so if we show that tower roof it should be with the same foggy, blurry hint that was used in map 9.

SD map: the shaft is the wrong size relative to the walkway of the floor. The walkway is only 5' wide, while the shaft is 15' in diameter.

Note that the tip of the roof of this high tower is still 60' above this level! Looking at the castle map with all the heights, I estimate the rafters (where Pidlwick II is hiding) being 20' aboove the floor, with the tiled roof then going up another 40' beyond that; maybe it's 25' and 35', respectively, but I don't think it's 30' and 30'. And I certainly don't think the rafters are any higher than 30'.

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Basement 1 (map 11), 40' below ground level:
CoS: the stairs up from K71 (which are stairs K20a) turn the wrong way. If there is a landing in K20a, the stairs continue up after moving south along the landing (not north, as shown in CoS). I like how the stairs K20a is shown in I6, with no landing and the stairs just twisting upward. I think Shindig did an awesome job of showing this in his map.

SD map: Shindig nails all the stairs here. Marvelous work.

K61 (elevator trap): SD map is different here, and doesn't match I6 or CoS. Map 11 in I6 and CoS are correct, but the bottom figure of the Elevator Trap diagram in CoS (p. 76) shows the stair up twisting the wrong way; they should continue twisting the same way that the stairs down twist (which is CCW when going up), not change to going up CW.

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Basement 2 (map 12), catacombs are 50' below B1, 90' below ground level; some other areas are lower:
Lots of levels! Shindig did it right by splitting this up into a few maps. You should split it into at least 2 maps: the west side (which is mostly lower than the catacombs) and the east side (which contains the catacombs and some other lower tomb areas).

The I6 and CoS 3D perspectives in map 12 can cause things to look weird because of the changing heights. Both maps are correct. But the 3D perspective makes it look like Crypt 24 of the catacombs (K84) is north of the K21 staircase, when actually it is south of it. If you look at the previous levels, you can see that the south walls of the stairs for K21 and stairs for K18 are level (i.e. neither stairs' wall is further south than the other). This means that Crypt 24 must be southeast of the K21 stairs, but the changing heights of the 3D maps makes it look like it's north of the K21 stairs instead. So don't go crazy wondering how the K21 stairs magically changed positions on you!

The stairs from K80 to K78 go down 20', at a 45-degree angle.

Typo in CoS: the stairs K79 are labeled correctly at its landing, but labeled incorrectly as K72 at their bottom (where they enter K78).

The stairs K79 go up 40' to a landing, then turn to the east and go up another 30', all at a 45-degree angle.

Room K78 has a brazier in it, not a fountain (or whatever that thing is supposed to be on the CoS map).

K74 and K75 (where the water is 5' deep) are only 2' lower than K73 and K76 (where the water is 3' deep). Therefore I think the stairs going down to K74 and K75 should be shorter than what Shindig shows in his maps.

The slide trap K82 is not the edge of a right triangle, as shown in the I6 and CoS maps (that would be too shallow of a slide). Instead, it's a bloody slide! Steep at the top part and getting shallower at the bottom end. That's a slide that will work nicely for the trap.

The 3D perspective of the I6 and CoS maps kinda messes up the look of K85 (especially along its southeast wall). The dimensions of K85 mirror those of K86, which is clearer in the maps.

K85, K86, and K87 are each 10' lower than the catacombs of K84. Stairs at a 45-degree angle.

K88 is then 10' lower than K87. Stairs again at a 45-degree angle. I love Shindig's windows in this room.

-----
I hope all this info helps people better understand the maps, especially with the few typos and incosistencies in them. I also hope it helps you with your creation of these maps. And thanks again for taking on this project! I can't wait to see the end results!

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## wthrasherb

Sorry I've been quiet folks! I've been busy preparing other parts of the Curse of Strahd adventure. Thanks for the kind words and feedback! I really appreciate everyone that has taken the time to stop by and comment.

@DownDeep: I appreciate you pointing out things you've noticed. I obviously have not started working on most of the stuff you are talking about, but I WILL keep an eye out for the issues you mention once I make it to those points. As for the Main Floor map that I'm currently working on, I'm not really concerned with how realistic the stairs are or their angels and such. It's like the old debate about the old Lara Croft's measurements if she were a real woman and how unrealistic she was... Lara Croft is not real, neither is Castle Ravenloft. I will ATTEMPT to make it a good looking map, but _it ain't gonna be perfect_ and I don't care if it is realistic.  :Wink:  Not to mention, Castle Ravenloft is 360 feet (109ish meters) tall! That is roughly 3 times taller than most real world "castles" and even tops some cathedrals and some modernish buildings. I still appreciate the time and thought you put into your feedback. Detailed feedback is really what helps me improve! Thanks!

That's all I have for now folks. I have been devoting my time to putting together a custom player's guide for my gaming group and it has been taking my "creative" time. I will get back to work on the map soon!

Stay tuned!

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## wthrasherb

Ok, my Curse of Strahd game has officially started, so now I really have to get things going with this map!

I plan to work on it all weekend, so I will hopefully have some updates to post. 

Stay tuned!

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## RCRAFT1969@GMAIL.COM

> Ok, my Curse of Strahd game has officially started, so now I really have to get things going with this map!
> 
> I plan to work on it all weekend, so I will hopefully have some updates to post. 
> 
> Stay tuned!


These are awesome and such  a great job/effort. Sucks Wizards didn't release the Castle Map or make one that is usable in a game. Any update on your progress . Would love to get my hands on these for my upcoming COS .

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! Again, I apologize for the long silence. RL has been busy and I started my Curse of Strahd campaign and I had to focus my free time on prepping the adventure and setting up everything in Roll20. I'm also about to be travelling on a photography road trip for the next week, so I won't be able to get much work done for a while, so I'm about to try to benge work on this map. I know I've got a long way to go, but it WILL be finished!  :Wink:   Anyway, on with the update...

I would like some feedback on the torch glows. I'm fine with the torches at the entrance doors. I did those differently. I'm wondering about the interior torches (as shown below). I'm not sure about the glow. I can do the torch without the glow if it is too distracting. I think it looks pretty good, but I'd like a second opinion.

Please comment and critique. All feedback is welcome! Thanks!

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## WolfgangSho

I'm not a massive fan of the torch glows:

Firstly, torches wouldn't produce that yellow of a glow, they'd look yellow themselves but their light wouldn't tint the surrounding area to that extent in my opinion.

Secondly, They seem brighter than the lights outside which doesn't feel like it makes much sense. Each individual torch would appear not to make as much of a difference in an already well lit environment vs being in the darkness of the outside.

Thirdly, they conflict with the lights outside which makes them feel out of place or would make the lights outside seem out of place.

Lastly, they are pretty visually distracting and really pop out. I feel like they'd draw the eye unnecessarily.

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## wthrasherb

Thanks for the feedback WolfgangSho. I agree. I'm not really attached to the torch glows. And now that I think about it, I don't think I'm going to include the torches at all. The file has a TON of layers already. I'll include some room details, but I'm not going to try to include every single detail.

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## wthrasherb

Hey folks! Sorry I've been absent for a while. I assure you I'm still working on these maps, slowly but surely. I have seen some others floating around the internet that are complete, but in my personal opinion, I haven't seen any that are that great. Functional, yes, so go buy them if you need maps now.  :Wink:  I'm going to keep working.

So here is a quick progress update... I've taken care of the chapel and most of the dining hall, although I'm going to create my own pipe organ, so I've just got a black box as a place holder for now. I have added arrow slits where they should be, but I still need to touch those up with some masking. I also faded the transition of the floor from flagstones to mosaic in K20, just for artistic effect. There will not be any torches displayed on the map to keep from getting too cluttered.

That's all I have for now... More to come! Stay tuned!  :Wink: 



EDIT: I just noticed I have to touch up the grid in a few places, so don't worry, that will be taken care of eventually.

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## pelinorerevived

> Let me see if I can explain.
> 
> If you look at the position of the large staircase that goes all the way from the crypt to the top of the tower (K18 in the original module) as compared to the nearby one that goes from the dungeon upward (K21 in the original), you will notice that on the Larders of Ill Omen (and above) that the smaller staircase's center is in a different relative location to the large one.  On the bottom level it is 10' west and 40' south of the larger staircase.  On all of the other levels it is 30' west and 10' south.
> 
> The long hallway that leads from the brazier room doesn't also line up with the crypt that it comes up to.  Here is an image that I hope helps explain it.
> 
> Attachment 81404


If you draw the western portion of Map 12 like this then stairwells K21 and K18 are in the right positions all the way up...



The problem in the original isometric maps is that the foot of stair K21 is 40' lower than the foot of stair K18. Because the first flight of stair K21 is only drawn 10' high, it appears to be in the wrong position in the map - but if you were to extend it another 30' up then it would actually appear in its correct location behind area 24.

I hope this helps.

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## MagniMagnus

Is there anyone that can print this to very heavy stock and sell for a decent price.?

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## sdooweloc

I found these in my search for some maps and they look amazing. Were they ever finished and if so where could I obtain them? They are just what I have been looking for for my upcoming CoS group.

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## wthrasherb

> I found these in my search for some maps and they look amazing. Were they ever finished and if so where could I obtain them? They are just what I have been looking for for my upcoming CoS group.


Sorry buddy, I never finished them. I knew how to use photoshop, but I DIDN'T know what I was doing with every bit of the map. So I was teaching myself a lot as I went and I was slow. 

By the time I actually got to playing my CoS game, other people had already finished the maps and made them better.

While I am flattered that anyone would still like my maps after all these years, I run a small business now and a local game group that tries to play as often as possible. I have very little time to work on side projects these days. 

Check out these links:

http://www.dmsguild.com/product/1989...Realistic-Maps

http://www.dmsguild.com/product/1859...olour-jpg-maps

Hope that helps!  Good luck!

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## danteinmix

Hi wthrasherd I´m just looking for any program or software to make similar maps like yours. As I´ve seen in the forum many of the maps are made with textures in software like gimp or photoshop, but I´ve read about other programs like Dundjinni or Fractal Mapper. Do you use any of these programs or simply you use image and textures to make your scenery? By the way I love your map and the details of the ground, stones of walls and clouds...

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## wthrasherb

> Hi wthrasherd I´m just looking for any program or software to make similar maps like yours. As I´ve seen in the forum many of the maps are made with textures in software like gimp or photoshop, but I´ve read about other programs like Dundjinni or Fractal Mapper. Do you use any of these programs or simply you use image and textures to make your scenery? By the way I love your map and the details of the ground, stones of walls and clouds...


Hello, danteinmix!

I use Photoshop and Illustrator to do my artwork. I utilize some "pre-made" elements from various cartography programs such as Campaign Cartographer Annuals, Dunjinni Community, mapTool community. But I've really found that making my own stuff is the best way to go. So I have spent hours creating textures and such just for my maps. When I was creating this Castle Ravenloft map, I was just beginning to try to do as much on my own as possible. It was slow and difficult to find "pre-made" artwork that suited my needs.

Photoshop or a GIMP variant is the way to go. Illustrator or a vector image app (Inkscape maybe?) is useful for making some elements. 

To "redraw" a map in a game book, or to do an original map of your own design really needs "freehand" drawing or tracing. What I mean is there are lots of "modular" cartography options on the market, but to use those you really need to create the map first THEN decide what purpose it serves. Some people like to design that way. I like to know what the purpose is first, then draw a map that is appropriate.

Since I first discovered fantasy role-playing games, I have drawn maps and thought up my own worlds and fantastic places. I truly love just to let my pen wander and come up with something and often I'll write something about it and bam... idea for later use! I have only recently (past 7-8 years) have been teaching myself how to do stuff digitally. Maps are also not my focus right now (obviously), but I'm working on balancing out the personal/day job life and some indie publishing. So I hope to be back on the map train soon.

As for what textures and such that I use: some come from cartography apps (as I mentioned above) but I have a photography hobby and take pictures of EVERYTHING. I also have tons of stock images I use for composite work and such. I take this and that and play mad scientist in Photoshop and see what happens. If I find something I really like, I save it for later use (perk of digital work). I'm also pressed for time and can be lazy when it comes to some of the more "boring" parts of the maps, so sometimes I may find a style or look of someone else or some random image and I will imitate it in my own fashion.

I sincerely appreciate your interest and your kind words. Apparently, I should have finished this map... People from all over the web (outside of this site somehow) have hit me up about it and still do (as you have) all these years later. That's AWESOME. Thank you very much. Please feel free to ask any further questions.

Peace be with you.

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