# Mapmaking Discussion & Philosophy (WIP/Critique) > Town/City Mapping >  Bourmout [pencil to color] WIP

## J.Edward

I've never really been a WIP sort of person. Many reasons. One major one is that I am usually working on 10 to 20 different pieces and I don't know when one will get finished or if it will sit and languish for months. This one did for awhile. I started back on it the other day and decided I would try to do a WIP of it. Even then I didn't stop to do progress shots and post them. I am often working on a piece for quite awhile and pausing to post WIP progress shots just doesn't occur to me.
However, people seem more interested in seeing the progress than the final product so I thought I'd try.
So... here we go. There's already several progress pics so we'll go from there.
This started with a pencil drawing I posted last month or so. http://www.cartographersguild.com/ge...-set-maps.html

Then I decided to do a color version. That can be tricky with a pencil drawing depending on how I drew it. Usually the more shading and texture I do on the pencil drawing the worse it looks as a color piece. We'll see how it works with this one.  :Wink: 
The color flat - Colors are almost always on the dull side at this stage.

Next I was tweaking the roof colors a bit and doing all those pavers. That took a while.

I saw that I would need to fill out the field grass more so I had to make a PS brush that could simulate the pencil look reasonably well.
Then drew in more grass lines and threw down some color variation. I also tweaked the shadows a bit at this point.

From there I did a bit more tweaking with lines and grass flow and more shadow.
At this point there's still a good bit left to do and some room for options.


Obviously any flat colors will being changing ie-the water and the dirt of the stream and the roads. Oh, and the trees.
Still not sure if this will look good with a border or not. I also am not sure if I want to do a separate version that has the buildings numbered and listed on the side/bottom as to what each one is. If I do that then a border seems like it would fit.

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## Wingshaw

This is an excellent map. Really well made, and a fantastically easy town to visualise. I also appreciate seeing your workflow (I hope I can speak for others, in that regard). For what it's worth, I would advise adding a bit of information about the town, such as the place list you mention.

THW

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## Chashio

I agree with THW... like seeing the progression of your workflow, at least once. And it is a most excellent map. If this were being used in a sort of online game type of setting, I could easily picture an interactive labels version being quite effective, with labels appearing individually on hover and elevation street views here and there. Extra points if clicking certain buildings brought you to their respective floor plans. No clue how to make any of that work, of course - but thinking of it is fun.

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## J.Edward

THW - I will try to get to that when I can. Not every building is a known quantity at this exact time.  :Wink: 
Chashio - That would be awesome. It could be done with HTML... too bad I'm not skilled in HTML. My ex-wife and I used to do work for a company where we did some interactive maps that way. But she was the HTML/web guru not me. I obviously did the maps.  :Very Happy: 
I would love to do that. It would be very cool to see. Of course, that would be a HEAVY investment in time for sure. [for me at least]

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## J.Edward

A bit more done. Some more texture and color laid down. 
Not completely satisfied with the trees at the moment but we'll see.

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## Chashio

Maybe the trees need a little more blue in their green? Or perhaps the highlights are a little too hot? It's amazing sometimes, how dark trees are in reality. ... It's amazing how many little paving stones are in that picture.  :Smile:   Looking good!

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## Yenski

Gorgeous!  Never been able to do the town maps myself, but this looks amazing!

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## J.Edward

Yeah, they need something. 
Here's sort of what I was going for.

I may put some stuff in that was not in the original pencil drawing. Some items sitting around town and what-not. Wagon, barrels, baskets, etc.
If I come up with something better for the trees maybe I might add some more trees out to the edges. I hate to cover over all that grass detail but it seems  a little empty on the edges.

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## Robulous

Very nice, although I actually rather like the original pen and ink drawing!

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## J.Edward

Thanks Yenski. Several people have said similar regarding towns. I've always enjoyed drawing little towns and villages.  :Smile: 
Thanks Rob. I like the original pencil drawing as well. Sometimes I just like to see what they'd be like in color. 
So here's some more progress. More color/texture on the stones and water. Tried an alteration to the trees. A bit more satisfied with it.

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## Ilanthar

Wow, really nice! The pavement is splendid. And I would never have thought to represent the grass like this ; it looks very good and give a sense of the land levels.

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## TimPaul

This is a great map. I like seeing the progress shots as well. Well done.

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## J.Edward

Ilanthar - Thanks. I really had to commit to doing the pavers. That's part of why it languished for a while. Working in pencil and ink really makes me have to try new techniques to represent certain things. I wanted to create a more rolling land shape. I'm not completely satified with the result but it would take way too much to change it all to get the effect I was hoping for. Next time.
Tim - Very much appreciated. I may do more WIPs. I do like the interaction which you don't seem to get with just posting a finished map.

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## J.Edward

I tried sketching in some tables and other stuff around the village. Wasn't very happy with it. It doesn't really show well at that size relative to the village.
I'm kind of at a loss right now for what else should be done with this other than maybe a border and the town info. If anyone has any suggestions - shoot them my way.

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## Chashio

Hmm. Any pastureland around the town, livestock? Maybe a stream of smoke from a chimney (though it looks like summer, so... cook stove), or a blacksmith's shop? Is there a blacksmith? Not that it needs anything aside from town title and info and maybe a border. It looks fabulous!

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## J.Edward

Thanks Chashio. That gives me something to think about.
Normally at this point, aside from text and border stuff, I would probably call it done. I'm just trying to see if there is something more I should do with it. In other peoples view. There's always a drive to finish and move to the next exciting project.  :Very Happy:

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## Chashio

> There's always a drive to finish and move to the next exciting project.


You're telling me. That's generally my constant state of mind... excepting that you finish more of yours.

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## J.Edward

I had some more thoughts on some stuff to do so I'm still working on it.
Here's an interesting twist... modelling Bourmout in 3d.....

It will sort of figure into the finished map... in a way.  :Wink:

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## Wingshaw

Very cool 3D model. Looking forward to seeing what you do with it.

This seems like an appropriate time to give you some rep.

THW

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## J.Edward

A few more screenshots of the 3d process in this post.
Thanks THW. The first thing was to get a better sense of the town in 3d. It has helped me to realize some thing I do slightly wrong with overhead town layouts. Nothing major but when doing roofs that overhang/project out quite a bit [2-3' overhang] I still draw some features like stairways that really would not be seen. Or only the edges and not much of the steps. I need to do a bit more work on land contours too.
Anyhow, here are a few more shots of the 3d progress.

Then from the north

Last from the south

I went with dark roofs for continuity while I work on the model. Eventually they would have the proper coloration as in the map.

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## Chashio

> It has helped me to realize some thing I do slightly wrong with overhead town layouts. Nothing major but when doing roofs that overhang/project out quite a bit [2-3' overhang] I still draw some features like stairways that really would not be seen. Or only the edges and not much of the steps.


Mmm. Sometimes can be difficult to balance reality and readability in maps.

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## J.Edward

True. It's just something more to keep in mind when I'm working.
I do try to think realistically but then do what I feel even if it might not be realistic, sometimes.  :Smile: 

There will be a slight pause in Bourmout progress as I'm working on the current Lite Challenge.

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## Chashio

> There will be a slight pause in Bourmout progress as I'm working on the current Lite Challenge.


I look forward to seeing what you come up with for that.

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## J.Edward

I think you'll like it. It is arguably the best map I've ever done.
I was able to achieve a number of things I have tried to do for years and never really managed properly.
I'm really glad I started doing that challenge or I would not have started that piece. I'm hoping to have the finished piece up soon.

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## J.Edward

Now that the Lite challenge piece is finished I am returning to work on Bourmout.
I'll post new revisions/additions as I complete that stuff.

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## J.Edward

So here's a new twist. I drew up a perspective drawing of Bourmout and combined it with the pencil map. I like the result. I might go this route for the color version but with more stuff. Like a heraldic shield and a different title piece. And some more involved but not busy border of some sort. Maybe I'll draw that as well. Who knows.


Chashio - if I hadn't already done it this seems like it would sort of fit your challenge idea.

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## arsheesh

This looks smashing!

Cheers,
-Arsheesh

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## Larb

That looks great. Did you use the sketchup model from earlier in the thread to aid with the perspective drawing? (I have been using sketchup as an aid for my recent building maps/drawings)

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## J.Edward

Thanks Larb. Yeah, I had an idea of heights for the buildings but I really needed to get a better feel for it so I modeled it. I will probably do that more often. It really is helpful to quickly visualize an area. Most times I draw from in my head, not using reference but this was a helpful, relatively fast and accurate thing to refer to.  :Very Happy: 

Are you using SU for the Shrine thread? I'm enjoying your work with that. The new Chieftain tower map is nice.  :Wink:

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## J.Edward

Thanks Arsheesh. It keeps making me want to do more with this town. 
I'm already thinking about floorplans and surrounding farms villages.  :Wink:

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## Larb

> Are you using SU for the Shrine thread? I'm enjoying your work with that. The new Chieftain tower map is nice.


Pretty much yes. It saves me a lot of time. I can often spend ages agonising over the perspective on a picture and end up redrawing things many times. And still thinking "is this right". But with sketchup I can just draw a cylinder and some cubes and I know everything is in roughly the right place at the right angle for when I do the proper drawing. I have been using sketchup as my "guidelines" basically. =P

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## Ilanthar

Just beautiful! The side view is just faeric.

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## J.Edward

Ilanthar - Thank you sir.  :Very Happy: 

I'm right there with ya on that Larb. I will be using SU more like that myself.

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## Alex Clark

Thanks for sharing - Great maps and models

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## J.Edward

Thanks Alex.  :Very Happy: 
I am working on some commission work at the moment so Bourmout has taken a pause for a short bit.
I am hoping to get back to it by next week, presuming the comms are done by then.  :Wink: 
Thanks to all who are checking back by.

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## J.Edward

This is the final work for the Bourmout color version. I decided to go with a backside where the town info is.
After doing the perspective view in there, there really wasn't space to put it on the front.
 
I may continue working on the 3d model of Bourmout if time allows.

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## Sapiento

Beautiful.

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## Bogie

Just Beautiful!  It's great having the top-down map with the isometric side view and the full legend!!!

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## arsheesh

Incredible work!

Cheers,
-Arsheesh

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## J.Edward

Thanks Sap, Bogie, Arsheesh, Larb, Pasis, Azelor. It certainly changed and transformed differently than I originally expected.
Doing the WIP process was helpful. It made me think differently. I appreciate all the comments and suggestions.
Now here's something not mappish but it relates to Bourmout. 
Since I did the shield for the map I thought I'd do a sword that might have been made in Bourmout.

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## Freodin

That is such a great map... but I have to admit that I liked the B&W version better.

In the coloured version, the sideview kind of drowns in the green surrounding. The lack of a horizon/sky is rather disorienting in my view.

Perhaps you could try to do a little fade-out for all the green?

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## Ilanthar

I can do nothing else but add another "beautiful" to the list  :Smile: ! A truly impressive work.

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## J.Edward

Freodin - A lot of people like the cleaner more contrasted nature of b/w vs color. No worries. I like both.  :Very Happy: 
I tried your suggestion. I didn't like the result. It was visually distracting and a bit out of character with the map.
I do understand what you're talking about though. If I had originally envisioned the map with the perspective in there than I would likely have done the whole thing differently to avoid that whole issue. But things happen as they happen.

Ilanthar - Hey, that's okay with me.  :Very Happy:

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